Huge Narrow Gauge Locomotives

[b***@despammed.com]

While looking through some of the stuff I managed to obtain on this last
church related missions trip to Brasil (with a few railroad related side
trips just for fun), I ran across an interesting item:

"As locomotivas Yellowstone" ( "The Yellowstone Locomotives" ).

Very loosely translated, under the photograph: "These meter gauge 2-8-8-4
locomotives, built for the Centrail Railway of Brasil by Henshel, were
some of the largest locomotives to operate on narrow gauge track in the
Americas."

There is another picture of one of these next to a contemporary (1937)
Henshel standard gauge 2-10-0, which is obviously quite a bit smaller.

The only other meter gauge locomotives I can think of that might come
close in size would be the Beyer Garrett locomotives used on the East
African Railway.

I'm wondering where that "some of the largest" comes from. I can't really
think of anything that size in narrow gauge in North America. Maybe the
Uintah or Sumpter Valley 2-6-6-2 locomotives, but those were three foot
gauge, and from the photographs I have seen, seemed smaller than these
look. Brazil also had 2-6-6-2 and I think a few 2-8-8-2 locomotives on
the meter gauge, but these were larger than either of those classes.

I'm wondering if these were just simply flat out the largest narrow gauge
locomotives ever used anywhere in the Americas.

Unfortunately, the book reports that the boilers were made from a
particular molybdenum steel that was popular in the 1930's as it was
thought to be superior for boilers. It turned out to be quite bad in long
term stress and fatigue apparently, and so the locomotives did not have
very long lives. The last one was operated around 1957. All four
locomotives of the class were scrapped by 1968.

[b***@despammed.com]

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[Benoit Poulin]

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[Access Systems]

Post by Benoit Poulin

Post by b***@despammed.com
"As locomotivas Yellowstone" ( "The Yellowstone Locomotives" ).
Very loosely translated, under the photograph: "These meter gauge 2-8-8-4
locomotives, built for the Centrail Railway of Brasil by Henshel, were
some of the largest locomotives to operate on narrow gauge track in the

http://narrowmind.railfan.net/2884_Brazil.JPG
Supposedly the world's only narrow gauge 2-8-8-4.
The weight you calculed in your other post seems about right if the
weights quoted in this document are metric tonnes (117.5t loco only).

Post by b***@despammed.com
I'm wondering where that "some of the largest" comes from. I can't really
think of anything that size in narrow gauge in North America.
I'm wondering if these were just simply flat out the largest narrow gauge
locomotives ever used anywhere in the Americas.

There is a fairly good list and pictures of US built narrow gauge
engines used in the Americas and elsewhere on this page (scroll down

of course not the "americas" but certianly some of the South African Byer
Garretts were near as large if not bigger

Bob
--
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[b***@despammed.com]

Post by Access Systems
of course not the "americas" but certianly some of the South African Byer
Garretts were near as large if not bigger

Yes, certainly. Don't know about South Africa, but the 564,000 lb East
African Railways 4-8-2+2-8-4 series of 1955 was also meter gauge. Its
rather difficult to compare those, seeing how some of the largest Garrett
designs appeared long after most other places were not building steam.

Brasil had a few of them too, but it looks like the biggest ones were all
on the 1.6 meter (5 ft 3 in) gauge lines.

[Gavin Hamilton]

Post by Access Systems

Post by Benoit Poulin

Post by b***@despammed.com
"As locomotivas Yellowstone" ( "The Yellowstone Locomotives" ).
Very loosely translated, under the photograph: "These meter gauge 2-8-8-4
locomotives, built for the Centrail Railway of Brasil by Henshel, were
some of the largest locomotives to operate on narrow gauge track in the

http://narrowmind.railfan.net/2884_Brazil.JPG
Supposedly the world's only narrow gauge 2-8-8-4.
The weight you calculed in your other post seems about right if the
weights quoted in this document are metric tonnes (117.5t loco only).

Post by b***@despammed.com
I'm wondering where that "some of the largest" comes from. I can't really
think of anything that size in narrow gauge in North America.
I'm wondering if these were just simply flat out the largest narrow gauge
locomotives ever used anywhere in the Americas.

There is a fairly good list and pictures of US built narrow gauge
engines used in the Americas and elsewhere on this page (scroll down

of course not the "americas" but certianly some of the South African Byer
Garretts were near as large if not bigger
Bob
--

The largest "narrow gauge" were the East African Railways class 59.

Shameless plug - checkout http://users.powernet.co.uk/hamilton

G

[b***@despammed.com]

OK, here we go:

In 1952 the Brazilian railway RFN received 6 Henschel-made Garrett
locomotives for the meter gauge lines. They were 4-8-2+2-8-4s.

I see them listed as 149,3(t) for the locomotive. On the other hand, the
2-8-8-4 "Yellowstone" class locomotives used on the Estrada de Ferro
Central do Brasil are listed as 105,3(t) for the locomotive, and 172,2(t)
for the locomotive and tender.

Now, of course, the question is: is (t) metric or short tons?

I could not reconcile the numbers with the ones I found earlier. Perhaps
the ones I found earlier were dry weight?

Either way, going from these tonnage values, these were not small by
narrow gauge standards in the Americas:

If Metric Tons If Short Tons
-------------------------------------------------------------

EFCB Yellowstone 232 150 lb loco only 210 600 lb
379 640 lb loco & tender 344 400 lb

RFN 4-8-2+2-8-4 329 060 lb 298 600 lb


They are still only about half the weight of the East African Railways
4-8-2+2-8-4 series of 1955 ( 357 000 lb adhesive, 564 000 lb total ), but
of course those locomotives don't qualify for the "one of the largest
narrow gauge locomotives in the Americas" statement that touched off my
original post.

Apparently there was quite a variety of Garrett locomotives in Brasil.
The table lists everything from two tiny meter gauge sugar mill
0-4-0+0-4-0 locomotives ( 26.5(t) ) retired in 1972 to express 4-6-2+2-6-4
express locomotives ( 191(t) ) on the 1.6 meter gauge lines.
Unfortunately, it appears that the only survivor is a 4-8-2+2-8-4 from the
RFN preserved in Recife.

[Gavin Hamilton]

Post by b***@despammed.com
In 1952 the Brazilian railway RFN received 6 Henschel-made Garrett
locomotives for the meter gauge lines. They were 4-8-2+2-8-4s.
I see them listed as 149,3(t) for the locomotive. On the other hand, the
2-8-8-4 "Yellowstone" class locomotives used on the Estrada de Ferro
Central do Brasil are listed as 105,3(t) for the locomotive, and 172,2(t)
for the locomotive and tender.
Now, of course, the question is: is (t) metric or short tons?
I could not reconcile the numbers with the ones I found earlier. Perhaps
the ones I found earlier were dry weight?
Either way, going from these tonnage values, these were not small by
If Metric Tons If Short Tons
-------------------------------------------------------------
EFCB Yellowstone 232 150 lb loco only 210 600 lb
379 640 lb loco & tender 344 400 lb
RFN 4-8-2+2-8-4 329 060 lb 298 600 lb
They are still only about half the weight of the East African Railways
4-8-2+2-8-4 series of 1955 ( 357 000 lb adhesive, 564 000 lb total ), but
of course those locomotives don't qualify for the "one of the largest
narrow gauge locomotives in the Americas" statement that touched off my
original post.
Apparently there was quite a variety of Garrett locomotives in Brasil.
The table lists everything from two tiny meter gauge sugar mill
0-4-0+0-4-0 locomotives ( 26.5(t) ) retired in 1972 to express 4-6-2+2-6-4
express locomotives ( 191(t) ) on the 1.6 meter gauge lines.
Unfortunately, it appears that the only survivor is a 4-8-2+2-8-4 from the
RFN preserved in Recife.
--
-Glenn Laubaugh
Personal Web Site: http://users.easystreet.com/glennl

Glenn,

Weights have a habit of varying dependant upon who is asking so any quoted
weights should be taken as a guide only. I know that Rhodesia/Zimbabwe
didn't change the quoted values when the refurbishement done in the 1980's
was carried out.

I think that it is fairly safe to use the following guide for quoted
values - UK sources will use long tons, US short tons or more usually lbs
and for European builders the weights will be that used in the destination
country, i.e. there is not a fixed rule. Otherwise I have heard the
following used - half a glass of water, full tanks & bunker which adds a
alrge amount of weight....

G